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| T O P I C R E V I E W | | andydeans3 | Posted - 13 Dec 2024 : 13:22:43
I've just had my ol' blue 96 in for an "Offline" Classic Car Safety test. Picked up on two things:-
Below par handbrake. I went through a lot of trial and tribulations with the handbrake on the green Saab earlier this year. There's a 2 page thread on the subject....
I'll strip, rebuild, and replace the cables, to see if that helps.
Perceptible play in front wheel bearings.
This is what I want to ask about here. I replaced these bearings 3 months, with new bearings bought, I think, from Malbrad, a long time ago.
Any thoughts on why new wheel bearings would have perceptible play?
I have a hydraulic press, and very carefully made sure everything was square, and fully home in terms of the bearings going into their housing. Although the centre nut is the tightest nut on the car, my torque wrench does go up to the required setting. I will check the torque again, but given that they are NOT tapered bearings, not sure if that will make any difference.
Thoughts?
1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
1975 RHD Saab 96
1991 Nissan Figaro | | 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) | | christophe | Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 20:56:30
quote:
Originally posted by beardydave
Just for reference, any bearing with a -2Z or -ZZ or -2RS has built-in seals and grease that can't be changed or regreased.
Our bearings are plain (no suffix at all) and require grease seals and grease to be packed in on assembly.
Sealed bearings may be fine, especially if you don't do too many miles or drive fast, but they may not last as long.
All modern cars use these bearings and they are usually good for 60 to 100 thousand miles, assuming they are quality items. So, I would not worry much about their use on a classic car. I also took the habit of getting the seals out to check the quantity of grease into the bearings, as some manufacturers are seriously shy about that. Besides, when looking at the cutaway view of the hub, the spaces between the bearing and the seals are not very big and I wonder about their actual effectiveness, but I might be wrong, of course. | | melle | Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 19:43:58
SKF 233200 is CN, so that shouldn't be a problem. The ones Andy has currently fitted are C3.
www.saabv4.com | | beardydave | Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 19:31:36
A 2Z bearing will likely be CN clearance, and may give running problems when at temperature.
Are the bores in the hubs in tolerance, or do they need machining out and sleeving? | | andydeans3 | Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 17:17:45
quote:
Originally posted by melle
You can just pop out the seals.
Andy, perhaps the "just perceptible" play is due to the bearings being the C3 type?
www.saabv4.com
Melle. Exactly what I've been thinking. I will check play again, after a run.
Andy
1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
1975 RHD Saab 96
1991 Nissan Figaro | | 72sonett3 | Posted - 18 Dec 2024 : 10:35:35
wheel bearing Saab/SKF 233200 is nla, NSK 3306 is a replacement.
SKF bearing size is 30x72x30.2 mm, NSK is same.
--
'72 97
'77 96L conv.
'95 900SE conv.
'99 9-3T
? 006 | | melle | Posted - 17 Dec 2024 : 17:12:06
You can just pop out the seals.
Andy, perhaps the "just perceptible" play is due to the bearings being the C3 type?
www.saabv4.com | | beardydave | Posted - 17 Dec 2024 : 16:12:25
Just for reference, any bearing with a -2Z or -ZZ or -2RS has built-in seals and grease that can't be changed or regreased.
Our bearings are plain (no suffix at all) and require grease seals and grease to be packed in on assembly.
Sealed bearings may be fine, especially if you don't do too many miles or drive fast, but they may not last as long. | | andydeans3 | Posted - 17 Dec 2024 : 14:57:50
quote:
Originally posted by christophe
Well, things aren't getting any simpler! I had a look at my old catalogs. I did not find any Saab listings but I found out that DKW used 3306C3 bearings!
So, right now, I would have a hard time to make a valid suggestion.
When in need of bearings, I always go to 123roulement: https://www.123roulement.com
They're very helpful, so I called I them to ask what their choice would be. The technician confirmed a C3 bearing would actually give more play than desirable on a FWD.
Here are his suggestions:
3306-A-2RS1-TN9-MT33-SKF They are currently available but pricey: 108,85€
3306-2RS-KOYO 10 days delay: 55,51€
Simplybearings has 3306A-2Z in stock: https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/p10120307/SKF-3306A-2Z-Angular-Contact-Ball-Bearing-30x72x30.2mm-Allow-1-2-Days-Contact-Us-For-Faster-Delivery/product_info.html
I think this would be my choice if I lived in the UK.
I hope this helps.
Thanks for all this.
I know 123Roulement, I've spoken to them in the past about gearbox bearings. Very helpful. However with this Brexit nonsense, it can be complicated buying stuff in Europe. (I was just made to jump through hoops of fire, to send a calendar to my cousin in Germany!).
However I digress.....
Well, I've finally got round to getting the car up, and feeling the "play" that the MOT man mentioned. It really is "just perceptible", only just, on both sides.
I'll also check them again sometime, when they're hot.
I'll keep an eye on it, and in the meantime will perhaps try and source a decent 2nd hand bearing housing, since I doubt these things are available new, any more!
1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
1975 RHD Saab 96
1991 Nissan Figaro | | christophe | Posted - 17 Dec 2024 : 10:28:57
Well, things aren't getting any simpler! I had a look at my old catalogs. I did not find any Saab listings but I found out that DKW used 3306C3 bearings!
So, right now, I would have a hard time to make a valid suggestion.
When in need of bearings, I always go to 123roulement: https://www.123roulement.com
They're very helpful, so I called I them to ask what their choice would be. The technician confirmed a C3 bearing would actually give more play than desirable on a FWD.
Here are his suggestions:
3306-A-2RS1-TN9-MT33-SKF They are currently available but pricey: 108,85€
3306-2RS-KOYO 10 days delay: 55,51€
Simplybearings has 3306A-2Z in stock: https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/p10120307/SKF-3306A-2Z-Angular-Contact-Ball-Bearing-30x72x30.2mm-Allow-1-2-Days-Contact-Us-For-Faster-Delivery/product_info.html
I think this would be my choice if I lived in the UK.
I hope this helps.
| | melle | Posted - 17 Dec 2024 : 08:23:46
Good point Christophe, I somehow mis-remembered that the SKF V4 wheel bearings were C3.
www.saabv4.com | | christophe | Posted - 16 Dec 2024 : 23:10:56
I found this on simplybearings's site:
C3 Bearings Summary
The bore, diameter and width of C3 bearings are identical to the none C3 version.
C3 are exactly the same quality but have a different a purpose.
C3 bearings have additional internal radial clearances to allow expansion in high speed / temperature environments.
Typically suited to hot and high speed environments ( fans, high speed motors etc)
They can feel loose until at running temperature and speed.
They are unsuitable where critical alignment is required from the onset..
Unless the bearing you are replacing specifically says C3 on it then you should not replace it with a C3 bearing.
So, I would avoid them for this application. | | melle | Posted - 16 Dec 2024 : 18:49:46
I think that will do the job – if you can indeed get it. I've ordered them several times from different places in the past; they showed as available on the websites, but no one was able to actually supply them.
www.saabv4.com | | andydeans3 | Posted - 16 Dec 2024 : 17:32:35
Melle
The bearings that came out are 3306 C3. The dimension within a tenth of a milli, are the same as 3306 C3, ie 72 mm OD, 30mm ID and 30.2 mm Wide, or am I missing somehting here?
Are you saying that this SKF bearing is not good for the job?
https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/p19814/SKF-3306ATN9C3-Double-Row-Angular-Contact-Ball-Bearing-with-Polyamide-Cage-30x72x30.2mm/product_info.html
Here an SKF bearing is also listed as 233200
https://www.bearingmodel.com/bearing-SKF-233200
1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
1975 RHD Saab 96
1991 Nissan Figaro | | melle | Posted - 16 Dec 2024 : 16:34:22
SKF are indeed a good brand name! The problem is that their 233200 bearings have not been available for a long time, even if some sites list them.
www.saabv4.com | | andydeans3 | Posted - 16 Dec 2024 : 15:53:56
Melle.
I'm obviously wrong, but I thought that SKF were a good brand name. I have a couple of new SKF gearbox bearings and they're made in Austria, NOT China....
1978 LHD SAAB 96
1978 MGB Roadster
1975 RHD Saab 96
1991 Nissan Figaro |
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